Signum system EC B&R

[Mr Chips]

Continuing on from your last post. .  about using other trends other than the symbols to decide which way to go when a  possible tricky decision has to be made.

This came up in a session from Wiesbaden 7/8/06. .

Row   #    BorR    +/-/0    PorM      Unit+/-
1       8       B
2      30      R        -1
3      36      R         0         M-1
4      17      B        -1
5      11      B         0         000
6      35      B       +1         M-1
7       4       B       +2         000        +1
8      16      R       +1         M-1
9      21      R       +2         000        +2
10      9       R       +3         M-1
11     18      R       +4         000        +3
12     24      B       +3         M-1
13     35      B       +4         000        +4
14     21      R       +3         P+1
15     14      R       +4         P+2        +3
16     20      B       +3         P+3        +4
17     18      R       +2         P+2        +3 ch

The session started off well with a strong D formation up until row 15. 
Previously the symbol collapsed straight away. .  This time a symbol has reached 2 for the first time, so do I expect it to collapse or continue to increase?

The reason I went for the increase is because I noticed a recent good trend happening in column4.  From row 10 to 15 column4 has gone +3,+4,+3,+4,+3,+4, so on the basis of this I opted for the P to increase expecting the run to continue in column4, which proved to be correct.

For the next bet it was straight forward enough with the  P symbol on the increase, and a stong trend in column4, black was the obvious selection, but unfortunatly it was a losing bet,, and decided to end here with the 3rd +3 units in the final column.

How was this session played Mr Chips. .  Anygood? or no?

I have to say I'm very impressed the way you have understood Signum, as so many have failed
to get past the first hurdle.

A very good D session. I would have made the same decision as you in row 15 and chosen to bet B.
21 at row 14 would not have given much time to think. If there was time  consideration could be given
to the 3,4 trend in column 4, also P has shown for the first time. However this has been a strong D session
so I think it favours B.

As it turned out the +4 was quickly recovered at row 16. Yes I would have favoured P+3 for the reasons
you gave.

I think even though at row 17, the session has reached entry 14 and still 6 away from the 20 entry cut off
it's a reasonable decision to exit at this point. It could now go through a C phase and after a struggle still
end up with +3 or less of course.

The D Formation has produced a straight forward profit of +3 units.

[droidman]

Here's a good run, Wiesbaden spins:

1   2     b
2   34   r   -1
3   3     r    0     m-1
4   19   r   +1
5   18   r   +2    m-2
6   27   r   +3    m-1   -1
7   6     b   +2   m-2   -2
8   33   b   +3   m-1   -1
9   35   b   +4   m-2    0
10  8    b   +5   m-1   +1
11  3    r   +4    m-2   +2
12  21  r   +5    m-1   +3
13  6    b   +4   000   +2
14  24  b   +5   p+1
15  12  r   +4    p+2   +3
16  30  r   +5    p+3   +4
17  18  r   +6    p+2   +3  ch
18  36  r   +7    p+3   +2  ch
19  33  b  +6    p+2   +3
20  15  b  +7    p+3   +4

[Natural9]

Here's a good run, Wiesbaden spins:

1   2     b
2   34   r   -1
3   3     r    0     m-1
4   19   r   +1
5   18   r   +2    m-2
6   27   r   +3    m-1   -1
7   6     b   +2   m-2   -2
8   33   b   +3   m-1   -1
9   35   b   +4   m-2    0
10  8    b   +5   m-1   +1
11  3    r   +4    m-2   +2
12  21  r   +5    m-1   +3
13  6    b   +4   000   +2
14  24  b   +5   p+1
15  12  r   +4    p+2   +3
16  30  r   +5    p+3   +4
17  18  r   +6    p+2   +3  ch
18  36  r   +7    p+3   +2  ch
19  33  b  +6    p+2   +3
20  15  b  +7    p+3   +4

Droidman are you playing the groups or are you just using the spins as they come out

Regards Rodney

[Mr Chips]

Here's a good run, Wiesbaden spins:

1   2     b
2   34   r   -1
3   3     r    0     m-1
4   19   r   +1
5   18   r   +2    m-2
6   27   r   +3    m-1   -1
7   6     b   +2   m-2   -2
8   33   b   +3   m-1   -1
9   35   b   +4   m-2    0
10  8    b   +5   m-1   +1
11  3    r   +4    m-2   +2
12  21  r   +5    m-1   +3
13  6    b   +4   000   +2
14  24  b   +5   p+1
15  12  r   +4    p+2   +3
16  30  r   +5    p+3   +4
17  18  r   +6    p+2   +3  ch
18  36  r   +7    p+3   +2  ch
19  33  b  +6    p+2   +3
20  15  b  +7    p+3   +4

A good C Formation session and when they are in a 1,2,1,2  and 2,3,2,3 pattern it definitely
going to be a profitable session.

[Nherisson]

HI,

I understood when we have to put "check" but I didn't understant what does it mean exactly?? What should we do when there is this "ch"?

Thxs

[Mr Chips]

HI,

I understood when we have to put "check" but I didn't understant what does it mean exactly?? What should we do when there is this "ch"?

Thxs

The idea is to evaluate the session, consider carefully how the session is progressing. If you are
getting close to the 20 entry cut off point and say you have a check at entry 17 and showing a
profit of +4 and it has been a difficult session, then it may be a good time to exit.

If you now replace the above +4 with a 0, then you have to seriously consider a break even result,
nothing lost.

A good reason for having a 20 entry cut off, is that as you approach it in a session, it encourages you
to make a realistic decision as to when to exit.

On the website there are a number of sessions, explaining about what to consider when there is a
check.

[Nherisson]

Ok, here is my first test:

18   R            
  8   B   -1         
18   R   -2   P+1      
24   B   -3   P+2      
12   R   -4   P+3   +1   
10   B   -5   P+4   +2   
34   R   -6   P+5   +3   
17   B   -7   P+6   +4   
  0                       +3   
15   B   -6   P+5   +2   
  3   R   -7   P+6   +3   ch
27   R   -6   P+7   +4   
35   B   -7   P+8   +5   
  0                       +4   ch
25   R   -8   P+7   +3   
25   R   -7   P+6   +4   
28   B   -8   P+7   +3   
  5   R   -9   P+8   +4   
12   R   -8   P+7   +3   
25   R   -7   P+6   +4   

Is it right?

[Mr Chips]

Ok, here is my first test:

18   R            
  8   B   -1         
18   R   -2   P+1      
24   B   -3   P+2      
12   R   -4   P+3   +1   
10   B   -5   P+4   +2   
34   R   -6   P+5   +3   
17   B   -7   P+6   +4   
  0                       +3   
15   B   -6   P+5   +2   
  3   R   -7   P+6   +3   ch
27   R   -6   P+7   +4   
35   B   -7   P+8   +5   
  0                       +4   ch
25   R   -8   P+7   +3   
25   R   -7   P+6   +4   
28   B   -8   P+7   +3   
  5   R   -9   P+8   +4   
12   R   -8   P+7   +3   
25   R   -7   P+6   +4   

Is it right?

Bien fait vous comprenez maintenant le Signum system.

In row 11 you got the correct result P+6, but what information made you decide on that instead of
expecting the decline of P?

I think I would exit at entry 16, P+8, +4. There is a +4 check then a further two 4's.

Regards

Richard

[Only1Word]

Here's a good run, Wiesbaden spins:

1   2     b
2   34   r   -1
3   3     r    0     m-1
4   19   r   +1
5   18   r   +2    m-2
6   27   r   +3    m-1   -1
7   6     b   +2   m-2   -2
8   33   b   +3   m-1   -1
9   35   b   +4   m-2    0
10  8    b   +5   m-1   +1
11  3    r   +4    m-2   +2
12  21  r   +5    m-1   +3
13  6    b   +4   000   +2
14  24  b   +5   p+1
15  12  r   +4    p+2   +3
16  30  r   +5    p+3   +4
17  18  r   +6    p+2   +3  ch
18  36  r   +7    p+3   +2  ch
19  33  b  +6    p+2   +3
20  15  b  +7    p+3   +4

Shouldn't M collapse to 000 at row 5?

Row    #    BorR    +/-/0    PorM     Units+/-

1        2       B
2      34       R        -1
3        3       R         0         M-1
4      19       R       +1                                    << With no previous +1 in column4. For M to increase it would require
                                                                             a zero in row5. If the current symbol was P, then it would require
                                                                             a new number (+2) in column4 in row5 to increase.

5      18       R       +2        000                      << Column4 moves to +2 after a repeat of red meaning M collapses to
                                                                             000 because M wanted a zero in column4 to increase.
               
6      27       R       +3        P+1                     << After a collapse of a symbol, a new symbol needs to be born.     
                                                                            As +2 is a new number in colum4 row5, then for the new symbol
                                                                            to be P it would require column4 here to increase. For M to be the
                                                                            new symbol it would need the opposite and a +1 in column4.     
                                                                            As it turns out,  a repeat of red makes column4 increase to +3
                                                                            which makes P the new symbol and is recorded at column5 here.

7       6        B       +2        000        +1         << With the previous collapse of a symbol, the expectation is that the
                                                                            same will happen here. With no previous +3 in colum4, a P would
                                                                            require a new number (+4) here to increase.     
                                                                            As we are looking for P to collapse and not increase here, we want
                                                                            a +2 so we bet black. Black wins, 1 unit gained and P collapses.

8      33       B       +3        P+1                     << After a collapse of a symbol, a new symbol needs to be born. 
                                                                            The previous +2 at row5 resulted in a +3 at row6. For P to be the
                                                                            new symbol it would need a repeat of that here. For M to bethenew
                                                                            symbol, it would want the opposite (+1) here.     
                                                                            P is the new symbol as black came making colum4 +3,  

9      35       B       +4        000        +2         <<As the session is in a 'D' formation with symbols collapsing, we
                                                                           expect the same here again. The previous +3 in column4 at row6
                                                                           resulted a +2 at row7, so for P to increase, it would want a repeat    
                                                                           here. As we want P to collapse we want the opposite (+4), and bet
                                                                           on black.     
                                                                           Black comes making column4 +4 and a winning bet. P collapses.

10      8        B       +5        P+1                     << After a collapse of a symbol a new symbol has to be born.     
                                                                            There is no previous +4 in column4, so for P to be the new symbol
                                                                            there would need to be a new number (+5) at column4 here. For
                                                                            M to be the new symbol, it would want the opposite, a (+3) here.     
                                                                            Black comes so column4 is now +5 and P is the new symbol.

11      3        R       +4        000        +3         << With a strong D formation of symbols collapsing, we continue
                                                                            following the trend. With no previous +5 in column4, a P would
                                                                            want a new number (+6) to increase, but as we want P to
                                                                            collapse again, we want the oppsosite a (+4) here. So we bet on  
                                                                            red. Red comes, P collapses and another winning bet.

12     21       R       +5        P+1                     << Once again a new symbol has to be established. The previous +4
                                                                            at row9 in column4 resulted in a +5 at row10. A repeat of this
                                                                            here would make the new symbol a P or otherwise it will be an M.     
                                                                            A red comes, making column4 +5, so P is the new symbol here.

13      6        B       +4        P+2        +2         << We want P to collapse once again as the session is showing a
                                                                            strong D formation. The previous +5 in column4 at row10 resulted
                                                                            in a +4 at row11. For P to increase it would want a repeat here,
                                                                            but we expect P to collapse again so we want the opposite, (+6).     
                                                                            So we bet on red. Unfortunately black comes in and we lose our
                                                                            bet. This also means that P increases to P+2.

14     24       B       +5        P+3        +3         << For the first time in the previous row, the symbol didn't collapse
                                                                            straight away, so a decision has to be made as to whether this
                                                                            is a temporary move from the previous trend or whether P could
                                                                            be starting an upwards movement.     
                                                                            Looking at column4, there appears to be a good trend from row9
                                                                            to row13. A sequence of +4,+5,+4,+5,+4. On the basis of this, the
                                                                            decision is for the P to move upwards expecting a +5 in column4
                                                                            here. The bet therefore is on black.     
                                                                            Black comes in for a winning bet. P increases to P+3 and the trend
                                                                            in column4 continues.

15     12       R       +4        P+4        +4         << As P is now on the up and the good trend in column4, the
                                                                            expectancy is for P to move to P+4 here. The previous +5 in colum4
                                                                            at row12 resulted in a +4 at row13, so for P to increase it would
                                                                            want a repeat here (the current trend in colum4 would dictate that
                                                                            anyway). So the bet here is for red.     
                                                                            Red comes in here and P increases to P+4.

16     30       R       +5        P+5        +5         << With P on the climb, we expect it to keep moving up. Previous +4 in
                                                                            column4 at row 13 resulted in a +5 at row 14, so for P to increase it
                                                                            would want the same again here. So the bet is for red here.     
                                                                            Red comes in for a winning bet and P has increased to P+5.

17     18       R       +6        P+4        +4         << There is no reason here other than expecting P to continue its
                                                                             Upward curve. The previous +5 in column4 at row14 resulted in a +4
                                                                             at row15, so for P to increase it would want a repeat of thathere.     
                                                                             Therefore the bet is for black here. Unfortunately, red came in and
                                                                             we lost our bet. P drops to P+4 and ends its continuous run.  

18     36       R       +7        P+5        +3  ch    << P reached a peak of P+5 at row16 and the run was halted in the
                                                                             previous row. It is expected that P may well be in decline, so the
                                                                             bet here is for P to fall to P+3. There is a new number (+6) in the
                                                                             previous row at column4. For P to ascend again, it would want a
                                                                             new number (+7) here. As we want P to decline, we want the
                                                                             opposite a (+5), so the bet is black. Unfortunately red came in and
                                                                             the bet is lost. P moves back up to P+5.

19     33       B       +6        P+4        +4  ch    << It appears that a 'C' formation is being formed now P+4,P+5,P+4,
                                                                             P+5. Continuing this trend we would want P to fall to P+4 here.     
                                                                             In the previous row, a new number (+7) appears in column4 for the
                                                                             first time. For P to ascend it would want a new number (+8) here.     
                                                                             As we want P to decline to P+4 here, we want the opposite and a
                                                                             +6 in column4. For this to happen we need to bet on black here.     
                                                                            Black comes in for a winning bet and P moves down to P+4.     
                                                                            Check is marked here as the units has reached +4 forthethirdtime.     
                                                                            We are at entry 16 now but in a good 'C' formation. If the formation
                                                                            doesn't continue after the next bet, then it would probably be a good
                                                                            idea to exit then.

20     15       B       +7        P+5        +5         << As we want the 'C' formation to continue, we want P to ascend to
                                                                            P+5 here. The previous +6 in column4 at row17 resulted a +7at
                                                                            row18. For P to increase, it would want a repeat here. For column4to
                                                                            be +7 we need to bet black.     
                                                                            Black comes in for a winning bet and the 'C' formation continues.


I don't know what numbers would have been next in this session. There have been 17 entries. I would have continued to follow the 'C' formation trend until the next losing bet and then exit.     

Hopefully, I believe this session is correct. Maybe Mr. Chips can verify it. I thought this might benefit some readers who might be struggling to understand the system.     

I'm off to do something less brain taxing now, like doing the rubiks cube behind my back          

[Mr Chips]

Here's a good run, Wiesbaden spins:

1   2     b
2   34   r   -1
3   3     r    0     m-1
4   19   r   +1
5   18   r   +2    m-2
6   27   r   +3    m-1   -1
7   6     b   +2   m-2   -2
8   33   b   +3   m-1   -1
9   35   b   +4   m-2    0
10  8    b   +5   m-1   +1
11  3    r   +4    m-2   +2
12  21  r   +5    m-1   +3
13  6    b   +4   000   +2
14  24  b   +5   p+1
15  12  r   +4    p+2   +3
16  30  r   +5    p+3   +4
17  18  r   +6    p+2   +3  ch
18  36  r   +7    p+3   +2  ch
19  33  b  +6    p+2   +3
20  15  b  +7    p+3   +4

Only1Word,

Yes your right I missed that, I think I must have Signum fatigue 

I'll have a break and go through your post later.

[droidman]

Rodney, yes I played the groups.

Only1word, I was wrong, but I based that M-2 on the run of -1,0,+1,+2
which I believed to be non-repetition, since -1,0 is a M mode move.

Maybe Richard could clear this up for us.

droidman

[Only1Word]

Sorry a few words seem to be out of line in the paragrahs towards the bottom.  Tried to amend it but just makes it worse 

[Mr Chips]

Rodney, yes I played the groups.

Only1word, I could be wrong, but I based that M-2 on the run of -1,0,+1,+2
which I believed to be non-repetition, since -1,0 is a M mode move.

Maybe Richard could clear this up for us.

droidman

The +1 is a new number and therefore to increase M there has to be 0 after the +1.

In the example there is +2 so M collapses.

[beo]

Hi all!

I've made a little tracker. 
It can download Wiesbaden Spins, select spins, and fill the 4th column => you just have to fill the P/M column. 

This tracker isn't designed for begineers to skip the understanding of first stages of the system.

It is designed for 2 things :

- quickly testing the system and making sessions from Wiesbaden spins
  (far quicker than testing with pen&paper)

- for people who fully understand the system and play it online on live wheels (or RNG maybe)

It will not be useful to understand the system !

The only bug I found is when we have two consecutive "0" in selected spins. 

Please repport bugs, errors,.  .  . 
Modifications are welcome. 

Hope you'll enjoy it ;-)

[Mr Chips]

Only1Word,

Thanks for producing a detailed explanation of the session, I am sure it will be very helpful
to those needing a bit more help to understand the system.


Regards

Richard

[Mr Chips]

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