3800 spins should be enough to spot a truly biased wheel.

toby · February 23, 2011, 07:04:34 PM

Kelly, do you know how to vissually detect a biased wheel? A hard task to learn, I only can identify some defects when they are obvious(for me).

I can't help collecting numbers at first, I try not to work alone to ease the work.

toby · February 23, 2011, 07:08:14 PM

Quote from: I have cookies on February 23, 2011, 01:15:23 PM
That is not true and no wounder so many end up in a trap ( pseudo STD ) is what you can call that as you don't have a clue if its due to random fluctuation or actually is a bias.
Other name for it is ( false positive ) and means that some one has to verify if a 3 or 4 STD is a ( actually STD ).
That is the math and probability you deal with regarding bias ( if some one not use defect spotting ).

Pick any sector of 4 to 10 numbers and try to reach 4SD on 3800 spins, really difficult to get, try 20 times if you can.

I have cookies · February 24, 2011, 02:23:46 AM

Quotereally difficult to get

Sure is.

Cheers

Steve · February 24, 2011, 02:53:14 AM

Depends on the bias. One of the ways is assessing wheel wobble. Stand where you see light reflection where the rotor and bowl meet (edge of pockets), and as the wobble passes, you'll see a flicker. There are many ways to assess a wheel for potential bias.

I have cookies · February 24, 2011, 04:30:46 AM

Quote from: Steve on February 24, 2011, 02:53:14 AM
Depends on the bias. One of the ways is assessing wheel wobble. Stand where you see light reflection where the rotor and bowl meet (edge of pockets), and as the wobble passes, you'll see a flicker. There are many ways to assess a wheel for potential bias.

Yes light reflections are our best friend ...

toby · February 24, 2011, 01:37:34 PM

It is easy to talk about lights and wobbles, on the wheels is not the same as at home.

I have cookies · February 24, 2011, 04:12:29 PM

Quote from: toby on February 24, 2011, 01:37:34 PM
It is easy to talk about lights and wobbles, on the wheels is not the same as at home.

Well i could only wish i had a xxxx and the time to get so serious involved as you

Kelly · February 24, 2011, 05:24:27 PM

Toby a small hint:

Look at the cone of the wheel and see if you can find a light reflex from one of the ceiling lamps. When the wheel rotates the light will be stationary if the wheel is perfect. If the reflexion on the cone is moving up and down or from side to side, there are some possible defects or unevenness on the cone. How you interpret the movements is a bit heavy and not for open boards.

What steve talks about is best done sitting looking across the wheel while focusing on the seam between the bowl and the rotor. Dont focus too much on light reflexes what you look for is the rotor going 1 - 1,5 mm up above the bowl and then down again. Focus on the high point and take a note of which numbers is located there. Most rotors will stay flush with the bowl at all times though. Those that doesnt has most likely a bend spindle, damaged by taking the rotor off. Its quite heavy and one should be very carefull when doing it, not all maintenance guy are that carefull. How to interpret the wobble high and lows is also considered closed topics.

toby · February 24, 2011, 06:45:54 PM

I guess the author of the book deserves not to let it on in an open forum.

I won't be the one who talk about details.

BR

Mr J · February 24, 2011, 08:25:39 PM

Wait, wait, wait. I had read that a truely gifted player can spot a bias in as little as two spins. 3,800?

Ken

telden · March 03, 2011, 02:28:03 AM

who really has time to get 3800 spins? I probably seen that many in my life and I play alot

only way it is reasonable is if you have a team.

YakHairSandwich · March 26, 2011, 11:12:54 PM

I've only got 500 spins so far, and there does appear to be a slight section bias, but I will gather more spins before I can say for sure.

Thanks for the good tips so far guys.

Steve · March 27, 2011, 08:05:33 PM

If you do proper research before collecting spins by observing for visible signs, your time spent collecting spins will be much more productive. There are many examples, but you can even hear some things. Like for example, with plastic pockets, eventually they bubble up ever so slightly and you can hear when the ball hits then, there's more of a popping sound. This makes the ball bounce less for certain regions. You dont need to constantly wait for the same pocket to be hit... once you know what the sound you're looking for is, you might hear it on one of the ball bounces every few spins. It needs to be an older wheel though.

YakHairSandwich · April 12, 2011, 01:42:36 AM

My wheel is looking very biased at this point. I will be selling some things so I can start hitting the consistent numbers very soon.

I have cookies · April 12, 2011, 09:12:23 AM

If not a visual defect - then make sure that the COR is 1 in 100.
Next after at least 1500 or 2000 trails - verify it with a new sampel around 1500 trails.
If valid - then you can play and will have a very high probability that you have a true bias and not random fluctation.

If so I can send you how to play to get the most out of that wheel with staking plan that is very good - witch been given to me by Lurance Scott.
Good luck :-)

PS a sector is better then pin point out indiviuall numbers that overall need a higher STD to become valid.

I have cookies · April 12, 2011, 09:12:23 AM

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3800 spins should be enough to spot a truly biased wheel.