Test of Clothdog's Root System

[bloomone2002]

Session1      Table 7     4/3/08
Spin#      number
1      9
2      20
3      17
4      5
5      24
6      4
7      2
8      4
9      28
10      23
11      14
12      28
13      29
14      36
15      4
16      1
17      29
18      10
19      7
20      30
21      22
22      28
23      30
24      27
25      12
26      36
27      7
28      4
29      24
30      4
31      35
32      15
33      34
34      31
35      17
36      15
37      26
38      1
39      14
40      16
41      3
42      35
43      12
44      5
45      22
46      27
47      6
48      10
49      23
50      31
51      25
52      9
53      31
54      30
55      28
56      12
57      25
58      0
59      2
60      16
61      29
62      11
63      7
64      29
65      4
66      6
67      10
68      19
69      9
70      28
71      9
72      22
73      36
74      7
75      18
76      34
77      36
78      7
79      9
80      15
81      0
82      13
83      1
84      3
85      33
86      11
87      14
88      23
89      32
90      26
91      30
92      16
93      35
94      34
95      3
96      24
97      4
98      6
99      34
100      34
101      13
102      30
103      24
104      28
105      9
106      1
107      18
108      16
109      28
110      8
111      30
112      12

[bloomone2002]

Session2   Table 10    4/2/08      
Spin#      number
1      21
2      5
3      7
4      31
5      16
6      0
7      13
8      29
9      14
10      7
11      27
12      28
13      36
14      24
15      17
16      26
17      3
18      0
19      10
20      11
21      31
22      11
23      21
24      9
25      31
26      32
27      30
28      24
29      34
30      35
31      6
32      25
33      32
34      33
35      17
36      0
37      3
38      22
39      35
40      26
41      30
42      20
43      3
44      13
45      14
46      11
47      36
48      35
49      17
50      33
51      16
52      30
53      22
54      27
55      15
56      26
57      34
58      22
59      19
60      0
61      7
62      12
63      27
64      22
65      19
66      2
67      35
68      4
69      27
70      2
71      9
72      13
73      20
74      32
75      11
76      17
77      34
78      5
79      22
80      4
81      22
82      26
83      21
84      23
85      4
86      29
87      16
88      10
89      12
90      7
91      27
92      29
93      31
94      18
95      33
96      25
97      13

[Natural9]

This method isnt designed for a progression tho possibly a  pluscoup type of progression might do ok with it

[bloomone2002]

last night my friend played my system at the casino. was up $1500 and walked. It wins but you have to watch the board and not get greedy. I use no progression.
cd

CD, what do you mean by watch the board?
Please give your evaluation of my test sessions in reply 45 and 46. One session works if I play the way friend plays and the other the way you play. I would think your system would work both ways for both sessions, otherwise I dont which way is best.

[bloomone2002]

Has anyone had any luck using this system on the two posted sessions in reply 45 and 46? :-/

[Clothdog]

Session1      Table 7     4/3/08
Spin#      number
1      9
2      20
3      17
4      5...17-5
5      24--win
6      4
7      2
8      4..repeater
9      28-win
10      23
11      14
12      28-repeater
13      29
14      36
15      4..win
16      1
17      29
18      10
19      7
20      30
21      22
22      28
23      30
24      27
25      12
26      36
27      7
28      4
29      24
30      4
31      35
32      15
33      34
34      31
35      17
36      15
37      26
38      1
39      14
40      16
41      3
42      35
43      12
44      5
45      22
46      27
47      6
48      10
49      23
50      31
51      25
52      9
53      31
54      30
55      28
56      12
57      25
58      0
59      2
60      16
61      29
62      11
63      7
64      29
65      4
66      6
67      10
68      19
69      9
70      28
71      9
72      22
73      36
74      7
75      18
76      34
77      36
78      7
79      9
80      15
81      0
82      13
83      1
84      3
85      33
86      11
87      14
88      23
89      32
90      26
91      30
92      16
93      35
94      34
95      3
96      24
97      4
98      6
99      34
100      34
101      13
102      30
103      24
104      28
105      9
106      1
107      18
108      16
109      28
110      8
111      30
112      12

[bloomone2002]

CD thanks, but I'm confused. The sample in spin 3 and 4 (5 and 17) are from group 5-7-8 and 24 is from spin 5 is group 4-6-9. How is that a win ?
I was working on these 2 sessions for the CD root system. It's appears you applied your workout to the key number. I needed help on the root system here.

[WhiteKnight]

First I want to say a big thank you to CD for sharing his ingenious systems which no doubt took a lot of time and patience to formulate.  After having tested CD's Key system with moderate success, I decided to test CD's Root system and have had a fair deal of success...started with $200 test money and brought it up to $720 in about 4 days worth of testing.  So once again, thank you ClothDog, and if you ever do decide to release your enhancements, I'd be more than happy to test those out as well.. So far on my real money account I've gone from $200 to $429...we'll see how far I can take it =o).

I think I have a decent grasp on this system, but in your post above ClothDog, I may be misunderstanding how you deal with a repeater (see comments below):

1 9
2 20
3 17
4 5...17-5
5 24--win
6 4
7 2
8 4..repeater   (How is this a repeater?  I thought repeating roots, or numbers in this case, had to be
                      back to back i.e. 4, 4, not 4, 2, 4 )
9 28-win     (Assuming that you are now playing on the repeater (i.e. 4,6,9 group, how is 28 a win,  
                  since  28 is from group 1? )


Below is the way that I thought it worked (bloomone, this might help your understanding of the root system also, I list the root to which each number belongs to help in tracking; hopefully i'm not misapplying CD's rules and confusing you even further   ):

Session1 Table 7     4/3/08
Spin# number
1 9               r9
2 20             r2
3 17             r8
4 5...17-5     r5   (play 7,8)
5 24             r6
6 4               r4
7 2               r2
8 4               r4   (lose, 4 spins without hitting roots 7,
9 28             r1  (start tracking again)
10 23           r5
11 14           r5  (repeater, play 5,7,8)
12 28           r1
13 29           r2
14 36           r9
15 4             r4  (lose, 4 spins without hitting group 5,7,8)
16 1             r1  (start tracking again)
17 29           r2  (play root 1,3)
18 10           r1  WIN
19 7             r7  (start tracking again)
20 30           r3
21 22           r4
22 28           r1  (play roots 2,3, and 0)
23 30           r3  WIN
24 27           r9  (start tracking again)
25 12           r3
26 36           r9  (is this a repeater CD? i thought they have to be back2back )
27 7             r7
28 4             r4  (play roots 6,9)
29 24           r6  WIN
30 4             r4  (start tracking again)
31 35           r8
32 15           r6  (play 4, 9)
33 34           r7
34 31           r4  WIN
35 17           r8  (start tracking again)
...


I also thought I'd mention that i do play a bit of a progression if I lose a sequence (i.e. 3 or 4 spins without a win)...the progression adjusts though depending on whether i'm betting on 8, 9, 12, or 13 numbers.

[Clothdog]

OK. I didn't know you were doing the roots. the key system was killing here. Anyways, lets look at the roots.
I think I have a decent grasp on this system, but in your post above ClothDog, I may be misunderstanding how you deal with a repeater (see comments below):

1 9
2 20
3 17
4 5...17-5
5 24--win
6 4
7 2
8 4..repeater   (How is this a repeater?  I thought repeating roots, or numbers in this case, had to be
                      back to back i.e. 4, 4, not 4, 2, 4 )There can be no more than one spin between them. I stated ths in an earlier post. I don't believe I ever said they had to be back to back.
9 28-win   I was playing the key system here.[/b]  (Assuming that you are now playing on the repeater (i.e. 4,6,9 group, how is 28 a win,  since  28 is from group 1? )

Below is the way that I thought it worked (bloomone, this might help your understanding of the root system also, I list the root to which each number belongs to help in tracking; hopefully i'm not misapplying CD's rules and confusing you even further   ):

Session1 Table 7     4/3/08
Spin# number
1 9               r9
2 20             r2
3 17             r8
4 5...17-5     r5   (play 7,8)
5 24             r6
6 4               r4
7 2               r2
8 4               r4   (lose, 4 spins without hitting roots 7,
9 28             r1  (start tracking again)
10 23           r5
11 14           r5  (repeater, play 5,7,8)
12 28           r1
13 29           r2
14 36           r9
15 4             r4  (lose, 4 spins without hitting group 5,7,8)
16 1             r1  (start tracking again)
17 29           r2  (play root 1,3)
18 10           r1  WIN
19 7             r7  (start tracking again)
20 30           r3
21 22           r4
22 28           r1  (play roots 2,3, and 0)
23 30           r3  WIN
24 27           r9  (start tracking again)
25 12           r3
26 36           r9  (is this a repeater CD?...CORRECT. i thought they have to be back2back )SEE NOTE ABOVE.
27 7             r7
28 4..             r4  (play roots 6,9) WIN HERE BECAUSE OF REPEATER I HAVE ALSO FOUND THAT IT CAN BE ADVANTAGEOUS TO PLAY ONE MORE SPIN AND IF WIN PLAY AGAIN TILL YOU LOSE. MANY TIMES THESE ROOTS MAY HIT OVER 5X IN A ROW.
29 24           r6  WIN
30 4             r4  (start tracking again)
31 35           r8
32 15           r6  (play 4, 9)
33 34           r7
34 31           r4  WIN
35 17           r8  (start tracking again)
...


I WILL GIVE YOU A LITTLE ADVICE. WATCH THE BOARD. WHEN YOU SEE A ROOT THAT'S BEEN SLEEPING OVER 20 SPINS AND IT FINALLY HITS PLAY ALL 4 ROOTS. SAY THE ROOT OF 5 HASN'T HIT IN OVER 20 SPINS. NOW THE 7 & 8 ROOT HIT AND THEN A 5 ROOT HITS. YOU CAN TAKE IT TO THE BANK THAT 5-14-23-32 WILL HIT IN ONE OR 2 SPINS. I ALWAYS WATCH FOR THE SLEEPER
IN A GROUP. ANOTHER THING I KNOW I'VE SAID TO PLAY THE MISSING ROOT. IF THAT ROOT HAS BEEN COLD YOU MIGHT STICK TO THE 2 ROOTS THAT HAVE BEEN HITTING. EXAMPLE..23-12-17. NORMALLY PLAY ROOTS 5&7 BUT WHEN YOU LOOK AT THE BOARD AND SEE NO ROOT OF 7 THAT HAS HIT, IT'S A SLEEPER AND YOU SHOULD JUST CONTINUE WITH 5 & 8. IF YOU SEE A 7 ROOT ON THE BOARD THEN PLAY AS YOU WOULD NORMALLY. SORRY FOR THE CAPS.
When I play the 123 group, I just play the streets. here is an example from live playat the casino sat night.
5
36
10
20..I played the 4 streets 1-3, 10-12, 19-21, 28-30
1-win
28-win
12-win
11-win
27 lose ...4 winners in a row.
Also i will skip a few spins here. the root of 4 had not shown in 26 spins. here is what happened and I capitalized.
6
30
28..so the 2&3 roots should be played
31....at this point the root of 4 finally hit
22....after seeing this I told my friend at the table look for 13(reverse of 31) to hit. The root of 4 is back in the game
27..miss
13..HIT ..of course I had it.
Skipping about 7 spins the next numbers to show
19
35
29....play 1 & 3 or streets if you want
19..Win
4
2
20...Play the streets here
29..win
2...win
2...win
30...win
So the advantage of not stopping after you win picked up 3 more wins. If I would have lost I would have stopped. Notice how in 11 spins the 123 group hit 9 times. I'm done explaining this.You're on your own now.
cd



CD

[bloomone2002]

Spin#      number      Group      W/L      Comments
1      9      r9
2      20      r2
3      17      r8
4      5      r5            (play 7-8, 4spins)
5      24      r6      L
6      4      r4      L      (new group, play 6-9)
7      2      r2      L
8      4      r4      L      (play play 4-6-9)
9      28      r1      L
10      23      r5      L      (lost 4 spins playing 4-6-9),retrack
11      14      r5            (repeater root, play 5-7-8)
12      28      r1      L
13      29      r2      L
14      36      r9      L
15      4      r4      L      (lost 4spins w/5-7-8),retrack, Play 6-9
16      1      r1      L
17      29      r2      L      (new group, play 1-3)
18      10      r1      W      (win, retrack, play 2-3)
19      7      r7
20      30      r3      w      (win, retrack, play 1-2 & 0)
21      22      r4      L
22      28      r1      w      (win, retrack, play 2-3 & 0)
23      30      r3      w      (win, retrack, play 1-2 & 0)
24      27      r9      L
25      12      r3      L      (r3 so play whole group 1-2-3 & 0)
26      36      r9      L      (new group, repeater root 9, play 4-6-9)
27      7      r7      L
28      4      r4      w      (win, retrack, play 6-9)
29      24      r6      w      (win, retrack, play 4-9)
30      4      r4      w      (win, retrack, play repeater 4= 4-6-9)
31      35      r8      L
32      15      r6      w      (win, retrack, play 4-9)
33      34      r7      L      (new group, play 5-8)
34      31      r4      L      (dang would have hit the previous group)      
35      17      r8      w      (won anyway, retrack, play 5-7)      
36      15      r6      L      (new group, play 4-9)
37      26      r8      L      (dang previous group hit again)
38      1      r1      L
39      14      r5      w      (won anyway, retrack, play 7-8)
40      16      r7      w      (win, retrack, play 5-8)
41      3      r3      L
42      35      r8      w      (win, retrack, play 5-7)
43      12      r3      L      (new group, repeater root 3, play 1-2-3)
44      5      r5      L      (dang, previous group hit again)
45      22      r4      L
46      27      r9      L      (new group, play 4-6)
47      6      r6      w      (win, retrack, play 4-9)
48      10      r1      L
49      23      r5      L
50      31      r4      w      (win, retrack)
51      25      r7            (play 5-8)
52      9      r9      L
53      31      r4      L      (new group, play 6-9)
54      30      r1      L
55      28      r1      L      (new group, repeater root 1, play 1-2-3)
56      12      r3      w      (win, retrack, play 2-3)
57      25      r7      L
58      0      r123      L      (play 1-2-3 & 0)
59      2      r2      w      (win, retrack, play 1-2-3 & 0)
60      16      r7      L
61      29      r2      w      (win, retrack, repeater root 2, play 1-2-3)
62      11      r2      w      (win, retrack, repeater root 2, play 1-2-3)
63      7      r7      L
64      29      r2      w      (win, retrack, repeater root 2, play 1-2-3)      
65      4      r4      L
66      6      r6      L      (new group, play 4-9)
67      10      r1      L      (dang previous group hit again)
68      19      r1      L      (dang previous group hit 2x, new group, play 1-2-3)
69      9      r9      L      (dang new previous group hit)
70      28      r1      w      (win, retrack, play 1-2-3)
71      9      r9      L      (new group, repeater root, play 4-6-9)
72      22      r4      w      (win, retrack, play 6-9)
73      36      r9      w      (win, retrack, repeater root 9, play 4-6-9)
74      7      r7      L
75      18      r9      w      (win, retrack, repeater root 9, play 4-6-9)
76      34      r7      L      (new group, repeater root 7, play 5-7-8)
77      36      r9      L      (previous group hit)
78      7      r7      w      (win, retrack, repeater root 7, play 5-7-8)
79      9      r9      L      (new group, repeater root 9, play 4-6-9)
80      15      r6      w      (win, retrack, play 4-9)
81      0      r123      L
82      13      r4      w      (win, retrack, play 6-9)
83      1      r1      L      (new group, retrack, play 1-2-3 & 0)
84      3      r3      w      (win, retrack, play 2-3)
85      33      r6      L
86      11      r2      w      (win, retrack, play 1-3)
87      14      r5      L
88      23      r5      L      (new group, repeater root 5, play 5-7-8)
89      32      r5      w      (win, retrack, repeater root 5, play 5-7-8)
90      26      r8      w      (win, retrack, play 5-7)
91      30      r1      L
92      16      r7      w      (win, retrack, play 5-8)
93      35      R8      W      (win, retrack, play 5-7)
94      34      r7      w      (win, retrack, play 5-8)
95      3      r1      L
96      24      r6      L
97      4      r4      L      (new group, retrack, play 6-9)
98      6      r6      w      (win, retrack, repeater root 6, play 4-6-9)
99      34      r7      L
100      34      r7      L      (new group, repeater root 7, play 5-7-8)
101      13      r4      L      (previous root hit)
102      30      r1      L
103      24      r6      L      (back to previous root, play 4-9)
104      28      r1      L      (new group, repeater root 1, play 1-2-3)
105      9      r9      L      (previous root hit again)
106      1      r1      w      (win, retrack, repeater root 1, play 1-2-3)
107      18      r9      L      (new group, repeater root 9, play 4-6-9)
108      16      r7      L
109      28      r1      L
110      8      r8      L      (new group, play 5-7)
111      30      r1      L      (new group, repeater root 1, play 1-2-3)
112      12      r3      w      (session end)

Summary: 112 spins, 105 bet opportunities, 36 wins and 69 losses. Maybe, someone can calculate whether this was a winning session or not. I think this is the way to play.
Please correct me if I am wrong someone, if there is a better way. Also, now that i look at  the 2 lost spins at the beginning, i think they would avoided by new groups qualifying therefore, there are no losing groups played in this entire session. However, Im not sure flatbetting this way profitable. But a progression, I sure would have been profitable here.
WhiteKnight, how did you get your output to line-up so well? , I came close.
Bloom

[Natural9]

i calculate approximately going by you wL 220 odd units won  was up over 300 at one stage can be quite volatile but seems recover ok was minus over 100 at one stage in the beginning

Another thing is you dont play the zeoro but is up to individual just zero is part of root group

Also going by you win and losses 36 wins at  25 units a time on averge is 900 units won

69 losses at 10 units lost per time on average is 690 units

So approximate total is 210 units which is around what i calculated going over that session

[bloomone2002]

Natural9, Thanks for the calculation evaluation. Thats sounds about right and a good reference point. Again, I think at the beginning It could have been played differently with better results and would not have as many losses, but even still a good recorded session.
Now, I would like to see an expert user evaluate my session. If this is correct! I can redo my sessions and hopefully get more consistent results, then continue testing accurately.
Bloom

[WhiteKnight]

CD, really really appreciate you taking the time to explain the repeaters, etc...I now understand that they dont have to be back to back.  Also appreciate the more pointers you gave us regarding the board and street play also.  Will miss not hearing anymore tips though from you regarding the system, but who knows, maybe in the future you will give us some more pointers, so thanks so much again!

@bloomone, the way your are playing above, is not the way that CD (correct me if i'm wrong) or myself play (i think CD mentioned that his friend plays that way though).  After I lose a series, I wait a turn and begin tracking as I showed above in my other post; I also dont requalify a group once I'm betting on a certain group, UNLESS it's a repeater, as CD had suggested in his initial post of this system.  You may want to recalculate based on the other way of playing and see if your results are better or worse.

As for the output lining up better than yours   I just spaced it out manually  

[bloomone2002]

CD, really really appreciate you taking the time to explain the repeaters, etc...I now understand that they dont have to be back to back.  Also appreciate the more pointers you gave us regarding the board and street play also.  Will miss not hearing anymore tips though from you regarding the system, but who knows, maybe in the future you will give us some more pointers, so thanks so much again!

@bloomone, the way your are playing above, is not the way that CD (correct me if i'm wrong) or myself play (i think CD mentioned that his friend plays that way though).  After I lose a series, I wait a turn and begin tracking as I showed above in my other post; I also dont requalify a group once I'm betting on a certain group, UNLESS it's a repeater, as CD had suggested in his initial post of this system.  You may want to recalculate based on the other way of playing and see if your results are better or worse.

As for the output lining up better than yours   I just spaced it out manually  

@ CD, I agree Thanks a bunch CD for sharing and for a peek into the enhancements it is greatly appreciated. I will keep testing.
@ WhiteKnight, I hear ya, but now, I guess that's what he is basically doing, althought he enhancements he plays even less. Why dont you post one of your sessions and we can compare more notes. At this point now, im seeing 3 variations to this
Bloom

[WhiteKnight]

Hey Bloomone, decided to give your way of playing a try after i calculated that your session would have won $260 and mine would have lost $63 so here's a small sample of two of my sessions tonite:

May 7/08

33-r6
9-r9
6-r6  WIN
27-r9 WIN
12-r3
24-r6 WIN

NEW SESSION

25-r7
19-r1
26-r8
30-r3
23-r5
30-r3  
17-r8
12-r3  WIN
8-r8
24-r6
19-r1
30-r3 (3 loses on root 8 repeater so start playing roots 1,2)
29-r2  WIN
2-r2
16-r7
30-r3  WIN

22 TOTAL SPINS

TOTAL PROFIT:  your way of playing = $114, the other way i was playing = $50

keep in mind this is real money and started at $390 and just finished at $504 from these two sessions...the first sessions wasnt even a full session because i got into the game when the dealer was nearing the end of the shift.  Not too bad, I think i'll test this way of playing CD's root system a little further but looks pretty good for tonite anyway...

[WhiteKnight]

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